Go Back   Physics Help Forum > High School and Pre-University Physics Help > Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics

Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics Physics Help Forum

Like Tree6Likes
  • 3 Post By Woody
  • 3 Post By oz93666
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Aug 16th 2018, 10:46 AM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Sri Lanka
Posts: 27
Question the relationship between he boiling point and the vapour pressure

As I understand it, boiling takes place when the saturated vapour pressure equals to the atmospheric pressure.

But, why does the vapour pressure need to be equal to the atmospheric pressure for water bubbles to form?

According to this video, the atmospheric pressure is cancelled by the vapour pressure at boiling, which allows for the bubbles to form (due to the zero total pressure). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffBusZO-TO0

But, I think the atmospheric pressure is the same. So, if we consider the atmospheric pressure to be 1atm at a time, the surface of the water feels 1atm pressure every time (I mean that atmospheric pressure is 1atm as same as the before, but the vapour pressure and the air pressure is acting as a partial pressure according to Dalton's partial pressure concept, it doesn't affect the total atmospheric pressure.)

So what is the real reason?
osalselaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17th 2018, 01:05 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Woody's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: England
Posts: 621
I would perhaps take issue with the video slightly.
I would suggest that bubbles form when the saturated vapour pressure is greater than the atmospheric pressure.

The boiling point (when the when the saturated vapour pressure is equals the atmospheric pressure)
is more a theoretical point we pass through between not boiling and boiling.
It not really a practical feature we will notice every day when we prepare our morning cuppa.

If one were to very slowly and carefully raise the temperature to 100C,
then reduce the energy input until there is just enough energy to exactly match the heat lost to the surroundings
(so there is no excess energy available to boil the water),
then the water will sit there at the boiling point, without bubbling.
topsquark, oz93666 and osalselaka like this.
__________________
~\o/~
Woody is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Aug 17th 2018, 02:29 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 392
This is the crux of your question ....

Originally Posted by osalselaka View Post
But, why does the vapour pressure need to be equal to the atmospheric pressure for water bubbles to form??
It has to be greater in a bubble ...in the video the beaker is sitting on the hot plate with 10cm of water sitting in it , the bubbles form at the bottom , rise , expanding and burst the surface .

The pressure at the bottom of the beaker is atmospheric plus the height of the water , another 1% in pressure , so the temperature of these bubbles is higher than 100C , they rise , expand and transmit part of their heat to the water, then only when they break the surface are they at 100C and atmospheric pressure .
topsquark, Woody and osalselaka like this.
oz93666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Aug 19th 2018, 05:33 PM   #4
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Sri Lanka
Posts: 27
Ok...if we consider a situation which is very closed to the boiling point ( such like 99C) due to the opened container all the water vapor will pass to the out of the container by the diffusion, meanwhile how there is a vapor pressure building on the surface of the water...

Also, as I mentioned in my original post will the atmospheric pressure change even when the vapor is gaining out of the liquid or will the vapor pressure acts as a dolton's partial pressure while the atmospheric pressure is constant every time?

Last edited by osalselaka; Aug 19th 2018 at 05:43 PM.
osalselaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  Physics Help Forum > High School and Pre-University Physics Help > Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics

Tags
boiling, point, pressure, relationship, vapour



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Physics Forum Discussions
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Stone Boiling THERMO Spoken Here Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics 0 Jun 13th 2016 07:53 AM
partial pressure of vapour = vapour pressure ling233 Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics 4 Feb 24th 2016 03:53 AM
Vapour-compression system Meesterslager Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics 0 Dec 19th 2009 08:01 AM
time needed to bring it to boiling alex83 Electricity and Magnetism 1 Dec 7th 2009 10:14 PM
Boiling point, atmospheric pressure binayakafle Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics 1 Aug 14th 2009 10:27 AM


Facebook Twitter Google+ RSS Feed