Physics Help Forum unknown vector of a closed space
 User Name Remember Me? Password

 Special and General Relativity Special and General Relativity Physics Help Forum

Aug 4th 2019, 12:51 AM   #51
Member

Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 71
act in haste, repent at leisure

posted the wrong version
Attached Files
 phys v13.pdf (389.6 KB, 0 views)

Last edited by RossBlenkinsopPerth; Aug 4th 2019 at 01:06 AM.

Aug 4th 2019, 01:11 AM   #52
Member

Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 71
 Originally Posted by topsquark Okay, done with reading 4. I am still very hazy about two things. 1) Obviously you can measure the relative speed between the closed space containing the strobe and red car. But how do we go from there and get the speed of the closed space? I don't see how your experiment can do that without knowing something about the black car from outside the experiment. -Dan
I assume by "outside the experiment" above you are referring to the red train,The experiment is not being conducted inside the red train.The experiment is being conducted inside the closed space.

The closed space contains the black train and the red train. the objective is to find the velocity of the closed space. the red train can observe any aspect of the black train, as the black train is not external to the closed space.

Last edited by RossBlenkinsopPerth; Aug 4th 2019 at 01:28 AM.

Aug 4th 2019, 01:18 AM   #53
Member

Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 71
 Originally Posted by topsquark Okay, done with reading 4. Which brings me to... 2) In order to orient the closed space and accelerate it (before anyone in the closed space is awake, say) to speed Vu we need someone outside the closed space. But all the "outsider" can do is bring the capsule to a speed Vu relative to the outsider. You seem to be saying (again please correct me if I'm wrong) that the outsider can measure the absolute speed of the closed space. I'm very sketchy on this part. -Dan
I just chose numbers out of the air to demonstrate. It could be two unknown velocities, it wouldn't matter. What the external observer sees or measures is irrelevant. Get a monkey to push them it makes no difference.

No matter what the velocity, or not, the ppl inside the close space can find ANY unknown velocity.

That is the purpose of the experiment.

 Aug 4th 2019, 01:21 AM #54 Member   Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 71 I measure the Vu of a closed space, call this Vu1 I fall asleep After I wake up u call me and say I may have given your closed space kinetic energy, I may not have, see if you can find out I conduct my experiment and get Vu2. I compare Vu2 to Vu1
 Aug 4th 2019, 02:05 PM #55 Member   Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 71 I got this response from a physics guru Firstly ignoring the internal inconsistencies, what does it mean? Second do I need to do a chapter on my assumption that C is invariant in local space ? "You are also under the misconception that "the speed of light is invariant". This is only true for one reference frame - which we might guess or assume is the reference frame in which the cosmic microwave background (CMB) radiation is isotropic as this seems to be a frame in which the average centre of mass of the universe is stationary. If we move with respect to this frame then obviously the light emitted must travel slower in the direction with the motion than in the direction against the motion. ." Last edited by RossBlenkinsopPerth; Aug 4th 2019 at 02:31 PM.
 Aug 6th 2019, 04:05 PM #56 Member   Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 71 I have assumed on small scales, less than 5km say, the speed of light is isotropic in a vacuum Is this a reasonable assumption ? I dont know of any science , or widely accepted science , that refutes this assumption
Aug 7th 2019, 03:45 AM   #57
Senior Member

Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: England
Posts: 963
Wrong, Wrong, Wrong!

 You are also under the misconception that "the speed of light is invariant". This is only true for one reference frame - which we might guess or assume is the reference frame in which the cosmic microwave background (CMB) radiation is isotropic as this seems to be a frame in which the average centre of mass of the universe is stationary. If we move with respect to this frame then obviously the light emitted must travel slower in the direction with the motion than in the direction against the motion
I don't know who you got this off, but it is totally contrary to standard Physics opinion.
This forms the entirety of the disagreements with the basic premise of this thread!

All studies and experiments that have looked for changes in the speed of light have failed to find any variation.
the speed of light is most definitely invariant

If it is not, then Einstein's famous theorems are wrong,
and most of the physics of the past century will have to be thrown away.
__________________
~\o/~

Aug 7th 2019, 03:54 AM   #58
Member

Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 71
 Originally Posted by Woody I don't know who you got this off, but it is totally contrary to standard Physics opinion. This forms the entirety of the disagreements with the basic premise of this thread! All studies and experiments that have looked for changes in the speed of light have failed to find any variation. the speed of light is most definitely invariant If it is not, then Einstein's famous theorems are wrong, and most of the physics of the past century will have to be thrown away.
I agree. I dont know what this dude was thinking. I think he was just going with his own personal theorem after a few wines

 Tags closed, space, unknown, vector

 Thread Tools Display Modes Linear Mode

 Similar Physics Forum Discussions Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post hbadgeress Kinematics and Dynamics 5 Oct 4th 2018 02:47 PM roger Quantum Physics 2 Jan 26th 2015 07:09 PM Stomper Thermodynamics and Fluid Mechanics 1 May 2nd 2014 04:07 AM SpeedBirdNine Kinematics and Dynamics 3 Sep 16th 2011 08:23 AM disclaimer Equilibrium and Elasticity 8 Oct 19th 2008 03:44 AM