Physics Help Forum Tell me flaw in this design

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 May 27th 2017, 05:46 AM #1 Member   Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 30 Tell me flaw in this design This machine is based on gravity power and seesaw system. We can make it more simple . As per sketch there will be two seesaw system and both will be attached with a stand.This stand will work to hold the seesaw.There will a middle track(MIDDLE TRACK SEESAW) which will work a pathway to transport the object from one seesaw to another seesaw. there will be two motors which will work to inclined the both side seesaw systems by pushing the counter weight side of each seesaw. When right side motor will work to push up the counter weight Arm of seesaw then it will be inclined and object will get start to move towards left side and arrived on the left side seesaw and now left side motor will work to push the counter weight side arm to inclined the seesaw and object will move towards right side. In this way each seesaw will work by their turn. I would like to insist on some following point. (1) The Stand will work to hold the counter weight so that the seesaw couldn't be imbalanced after unloading the object. (2) we can set up a generator under the counter weight to generate energy or can get gain due to kinetic energy of ball.. (3)the length of middle track will be less than the length of arm of seesaws. (4)The motors will work to push the counter weights towards upside . (5)we can take the object(Rolling Ball) mass from 100 to 1000 kilogram or more as we all know that if a seesaw is balanced then we can lift up or lift down it even with the power of our finger tips . (6)The middle track will also work like a SEESAW system and will work as a bridge to fill the gap between Left and Right side seesaw when seesaws will be inclined. The middle track seesaw either get energy from a motor or directly connected with both side seesaw when counter weight arm will be lift up then this arm will also work to lift up the second part of middle seesaw and middle track Arm will be come down to work as a bridge. (7) This design will work as a free energy device .The counter weight arm of both side seesaws will work to generate electricity when this counter weight arm will hit the piston generator then the generator will work to produce energy. (8)Friction will be not an issue in this design BECAUSE THE LENGTH OF MIDDLE TRACK WILL BE very LESS THAN BENT ARMS AND ABOVE ALL DEPEND THE VELOCITY OF BALL. (9) Use potential energy formula when stand attached with counter weight (100 kilogram) will hit the piston generator and motor works to lift up the seesaw up to 20 centimeter. P.E.=mgh P.E.=100*10*.20 =200 joule The out put will be 200 joule but input will be only 10 to 15 joule by motors as we all know that IF A SEESAW IS IN BALANCED POSITION NO MATTER HOW MUCH IT IS HEAVY,THEN THERE WILL BE NEED OF VERY VERY LESS FORCE TO MOVE IT OR MOVE DOWN. IN THIS WAY THIS SYSTEM WILL WORK.THE VELOCITY OR KINETIC ENERGY OF BALL WILL BE ALSO USEFUL TO GENERATE ENERGY WHILE IT WILL BE ROLLING DOWN ON CURVED SURFACE OF LEFT SIDE SEESAW . (10) The main point in this design is only input force ,that is very very less and the rest work will be done by gravity itself. (11)I have done several experiments on it to know the feasibility of this design and my experiments clearly shows me that it must work .There is No doubt regarding the feasibility of this design even I'm VERY MUCH surprised that physics laws are playing a supportive role in this design. (12) seesaw will be designed like Two Pan balance. Tell me If there is any Flaw in this design. Attached Thumbnails
 May 27th 2017, 07:42 PM #2 Senior Member   Join Date: Apr 2017 Posts: 318 I can't pretend I follow your text or diagram ...you seem to be using leavers in an attempt to get more work out than you put in ...it can't be done . But I don't expect you to believe me , push on with your experiments and thoughts ...it's all very good practice and training ...maybe one day you'll come up with a great invention .
 May 27th 2017, 08:28 PM #3 Member   Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 30 Reply I'm building it and I would like to tell you that only one thing will be happened in this design .Either newton is wrong or Archimedes. I would also like to tell that The laws of energy will not work here as it is not a closed loop system. tell me only one thing How much energy or force is required to lift up a balanced seesaw as your answer will be sufficient to convince you and clear your all doubts. Last edited by vkrmvkrm11; May 27th 2017 at 08:34 PM. Reason: add more points
May 28th 2017, 01:11 AM   #4
Senior Member

Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 318
 Originally Posted by vkrmvkrm11 tell me only one thing How much energy or force is required to lift up a balanced.
it would be energy required to do this ...force over the distance it acts will give the energy ..

To find the energy you need to know how much mass has been raise by how much ...look at the system where is the mass?( or center of mass of each part) and how much it's hight has changed........... E= mgh ,

So if the mass is 100kg and it rises 1 meter ... E= 100 x 9.8 x 1 =980 J

a 100W motor working for 9.8 secs ...of a 1kw motor working for 0.98 secs

 May 28th 2017, 02:28 AM #5 Member   Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 30 See the sketch carefully .the mass is rolling ball (100kg.)and how are you calculating as I'm m very much surprised that you don't have basic physics knowledge.if a seesaw is in balanced position then only 2 to 3 Newton force is sufficient to move it up. Remember seesaw is BALANCED.
May 28th 2017, 05:38 AM   #6
Senior Member

Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 318
 Originally Posted by vkrmvkrm11 See the sketch carefully .the mass is rolling ball (100kg.)and how are you calculating as I'm m very much surprised that you don't have basic physics knowledge.if a seesaw is in balanced position then only 2 to 3 Newton force is sufficient to move it up. Remember seesaw is BALANCED.
If a see saw is perfectly balanced then the work is done by the weight on the other side moving down...one weight moves up, the other down , no energy can be taken out

 May 29th 2017, 12:49 PM #7 Physics Team     Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Morristown, NJ USA Posts: 2,287 I am trying to understand the mechanism, so please help me you - do I understand this correctly? In the figure the 100 Kg ball is on the right side, on an inclined ramp, and hence rolling to the right - is that correct? Then the motor on the right activates to lift the right hand side of the seesaw, causing the ball to stop and then roll back to the left. Your point seems to be that when the ball is close to the right hand pivot the seesaw is in balance, so it take little energy to tilt the seesaw so the the ball starts to roll left. Of course it rolls downhill, so when it reaches the middle span it's lower than where it started, so does the midlel span lower itself to line up with the ball? I'm pretty sure that at this point I am not understanding your mechanism. It would really be helpful if you could add a few sketches showing the how the mechanism moves.
 May 30th 2017, 04:28 AM #8 Member   Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 30 reply to Mr chip Dear sir, thank you for your interest. the motor will not work to stop the ball but will work to tilt the seesaw.When the motor will push up the counter weight arm of right side seesaw then the seesaw will be tilted and ball will get started rolling down . the ball and counterweight will be in equilibrium . The middle track will be designed also like a seesaw and will work as a bridge to connect the right and left side seesaw as you know that when the right side seesaw will be tilted then a gap will be created which will work to prevent the ball to transport from right to left side seesaw . This middle track will work to fill this gap and ball will be transported easily . The whole system will work on Archimedes principle. Sir,If sketches are not visible clearly then tell me your EMAIL address so that I could send them . If you have any doubts then please tell me so that I could clear your all doubts. Vikram Attached Thumbnails
 May 30th 2017, 04:58 AM #9 Physics Team     Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Morristown, NJ USA Posts: 2,287 The picture helps, but still leaves doubt as to how the mechanism is intended to work. In the second picture the ball is rolling to the left - what's confusing is it looks like the length of the left side of the right seesaw which the ball is rolling on is quite short, so it won't have much velocity when it crosses the middle bridge. Once it crosses the bridge I assume it encounters the left seesaw which is tilted so that the ball rolls uphill, eventually comes to a top, then rolls back to the right - is that correct? I don't understand the purpose of the middle bridge - you call it a seesaw but I don't see it tilting. Please clarify its function. Thanks. mash likes this. Last edited by ChipB; May 30th 2017 at 09:43 AM.
 Jun 3rd 2017, 05:22 AM #10 Member   Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 30 reply to Mr chip The length of arm of seesaws is not important as it is a rough sketch but try to understand the concept what I want to say. In this design the ball will be rolled back and forth between the two seesaws. The motors will rise the opposite end of the seesaw with no effort due to the counterweights. If we start from the right seesaw: right motor rise the right side of the seesaw. Then, right side of the seesaw tilts down, and the ball starts rolling towards right hand side of left seesaw. The middle arm (1-arm) are moved down to guide the ball into the right side seesaw. The right side seesaw with no ball on it yet, must be forced down because there is no balance at the moment. The cycle repeats from right to left and vice versa. The middle track seesaw will work to prevent the ball to get jammed between the end part of tilted down right side seesaw and left side seesaw. Now you will ask me that after unloading the ball or mass the right seesaw will get tilted down so How do you then get the right side seesaw back so the ball can enter it again from left to right? if you look carefully the sketch then you will find that a Stand is connect in vertical position with each counter weight arm and this stand will work as a support to prevent the seesaw to get I'm balanced after unloading the mass or ball. Now you will raise again a question that when ball will enter on left seesaw then it will be flipped down due to ball mass and distance from fulcrum but there is a very simple solution of this problem.The solution is a Lock system which will work to lock the seesaw before loading the mass but unlocked at the time of transporting the ball. The overall input and mechanical losses will be only 6 to 10 joule maximum but output will be more.A 20 kilogram counterweight will generate 40 joule energy after lifting up 20 centimeter height as per potential energy formula. Attached Thumbnails

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